The Council of Wyrms

[Wish]

yup, you're right

[Ygorl]

Aha! Brilliant, Cainehill. Thanks.
Now if I can only figure out how to make that not happen...

[shovah]

ok wtf, i found it in my spam folder and unzipped nito my CoW folder and got turn................... 65

[Ygorl]

Shovah, did you read Cainehill's message and check in your COW folder? If you don't see another COW folder inside your COW folder, with turn 70 in it, let me know and I'll send it to you again.
Thanks.

[shovah]

i see it but i cant open it, i'll tyr again

[shovah]

sorry for double posting, i managed to open the file and its empty, so im still stuck on turn 65 here.

[Cainehill]

Did you look in the game directory and see if there's a CoW subdirectory with the file in it?

[Ygorl]

I sent you another email yesterday with your .trn file attached. Did you get that one? It wasn't compressed in any way, so there shouldn't be any .zip problems...

[shovah]

kk, ive got it

ps: please send like that in future if possible

[PashaDawg]

Yes yes. Non-zip files would be preferred by me, too!!

[Ygorl]

Voting is 2-0 in favor of unzipped files. Since there's no quorum requirement here, they'll be unzipped in the future. If there's anyone out there who'd strongly prefer a zipped file, speak up! (dialup, anyone?)
If we've got strong divided preferences, I can probably figure out a reasonable way to zip only some of them (as if by magic!) but sending them all out raw is easy for me.

[Morkilus]

Unzipped is fine by me. The extra time for download is better than by the clickety-clickety involved with the zips. I always assumed it was because zips were more reliable, but there ya go.

[Ygorl]

Still missing turns from Abysia and C'tis. I will host at or soon after 8pm EDT tonight, so I really hope I get them by then. If you guys have already sent them and they got lost in the ether, resend them and let me know.

[Cainehill]

Oops - thought I had sent mine already. On its way.

[shovah]

come on guys, i wana see my turn http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

edit: is anyone interestied in trading my blood slaves or firegems for some earth gems or water gems? pm me for more info.

[shovah]

turns sent, every1 get theirs ok?

[puffyn]

Whoever keeps sending disease-spreaders into Fas Dir (I'm looking at you, dragon) had better stop it, or there will be consequences.

-Apep, the perturbed

[shovah]

i have only owned a single banevenom charm holder all game and he spent his entire life in my own territory, ive been suffering from disease aswell although me patrolling every province seems to have scared them off (i have noticed quite a few stealthy units from marignon being caught by my forces but so far no disease spreaders)

[djo]

We'll cop to the assassin and succubus (poor Candy, she was just site-seeing). But disease, that isn't our style...

[shovah]

sorry candy, i'll send flowers for the funeral, when would you like her corpse?

[Ygorl]

I had a transient plague-wanderer last month... Not sure who it was, but it was gone this month, so no big deal.

[shovah]

puffyn, who neighbours you? same question to you ygorl. my neighbours are (iirc) aby, ctis, marignon, mict and jotun, if we can figure out who we all neighbour then we atleast have a reasonable suspect for these disease spreaders.

[puffyn]

This is the second time a disease spreader has come in through our border with Machaka, shovah, so naturally our thoughts turned to you. Our lands border only Machaka, Abysia, Ulm, and Man (excepting our sea provinces, which can't be flown across and moreover have never been diseased), so that does not leave a large list of possible candidates.

[PashaDawg]

'Tis not Ulm!

[Ygorl]

If there's some diseased vagabond (or vagabonds!) wandering the earth, there's no reason it (or they!) had to come from a neighboring nation. I have no neighbors in common with both Machaka and Mictlan. Moreover, my infected province was near Vanheim, C'tis, and Ermor (C'tis staled, and the other two aren't neighbors of Machaka or Mictlan). Looks like someone's broadcasting love all across the land...

[shovah]

well fas dir does contain 2 well's of pestilence, i know this thanks to the large amount of spies i have. as ive said i only ever had 1 disease spreader and he didnt touch mict.

[Ygorl]

Missing turns from Atlantis, C'tis, Ermor, Marignon, T'ien Ch'i, Ulm, and Vanheim.

I will probably host a bit late tonight, unless I receive everyone's turns by 7 pm or so (in which case I'll host then). I've got a friend's birthday to celebrate.

[Morkilus]

I think we all remember who first began hiring help of THIS kind.

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c218/Morkilus/harvestermug.jpg

[shovah]

i dont, i havnt been in this long.

[Ygorl]

That was me. Puffyn sent them all back to the shadow world, though, and I haven't bothered to resummon them (yet).
And, I think we also all remember that they remained confined within my own realm until I went to war. Nice try, though... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Ygorl]

And, of course, by "Sunday" I mean "Tuesday". Stupid me.

[Morkilus]

Just a little propaganda, neighbor. Congrats for surviving the "war" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

- Vanlade, Court Jester

[Ygorl]

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Ygorl]

Missing .2h files from Arcoscephale, Atlantis, C'tis, Mictlan, and T'ien Ch'i. Hosting in 9.5 hours. Cheers!

[puffyn]

Ygorl,

I sent you my file last night. I did change the subject to "COW Turn 72", so maybe it got misfiled? I can resend if need be.

-puffyn

[Ygorl]

I haven't received any emails from you since last turn... Best to try sending it again.

[puffyn]

On its way... let me know when it arrives.

[Ygorl]

Got it. Thanks.

[Ygorl]

Missing turns from C'tis, Ermor, Machaka, Marignon, Pangaea, T'ien Ch'i, and Ulm. Hosting in 9 hours.

[PashaDawg]

Mine was sent about 1.5 hrs ago (but just before the deadline).

[Ygorl]

Yeah, I got it. I didn't get back home to host until around 11:30.

Everyone should have gotten their turns by now. A few people may have gotten them twice; I think there was a hiccup in the script.

[shovah]

going to be out for the weekend, sorry for the short notice.

[Ygorl]

You've already sent your turn, so it doesn't even matter (unless a proposition comes up that you would want to say something about). Enjoy the outing, I hope!

By the way, I never got those five gems that you promised... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[shovah]

im back, and im not a wyrm so no voting anyway http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Ygorl]

With eight hours to go, I'm missing turns from Vanheim, C'tis, and Ermor. Ermor staled last turn, and C'tis has staled the last five turns. I'm not yet worried about Ermor, but I'm starting to get concerned about C'tis.

[RonD]

With the odd nature of this game's setup, I think it is a lot less disruptive to have stales than it would be to have an AI.

[Cainehill]

Eh - the AI would simply be treated as rogue. Mind, there should be advance notice.

[Ygorl]

I wasn't suggesting AI... More thinking of a sub or replacement. I know Huntsman's got some tough stuff going on in the real world, so it's not too surprising that he hasn't been taking his turns; I don't know if or when he'll have more leisure time to play. I think, though, if he misses the next couple turns we should start looking for someone to take over (and preferably someone who'd be willing to give the reins back to Huntsman if he is able to come back at some point).

I'd hate to see the game become "sit around doing nothing until someone drops out, then scramble to take their lands". I know this is a bit contrary to a proposition I put forth a while back, but, well... I'm wiser now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[shovah]

you wouldnt happen to be far away from his lands would you?

[Ygorl]

He's actually one of my neighbors, and ended up with one of my provinces as a result of the Man vs. Pangea-et-al war...

So put away your conspiracy theories... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[shovah]

NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

on an unrelated note Apep over in Mictlan is getting annoying with his assasinating heleophagi and stealthy demon lord (if i leave the heleophagi, i lose commanders. if i patrol for him i catch the lord and lose a province for a turn)

[puffyn]

The assasinations will continue until morale improves.

Lest anyWyrm believe the matter to be one-sided, we have been afflicted by:

2 Bane Spider Assassins caught in our lands (though I believe one was before shovah took control)
1 Black Servant with a stone idol caught in our very capitol
2 instances of disease spreaders coming into our lands from Machaka's border -- don't believe his lying protestations of innocence.

All's fair in sneaky war http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

[shovah]

bane spider and black servant where there long before i took control, i saw no purpose in moving them anywhere else.
And im still insistant that i am not spreading disease (unless one of machakas stealthy units spreads disease automatically) because 1: at this late point in the game money is near irrelivant, 2: i wouldnt know where your blood hunting areas are to target them (how i wish i did http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif) and 3: i have far better uses for my gems than that.

[Ygorl]

The new turn is out. A couple people got double emails... Sorry about that, I know what happened, and I'm fixing it. Cheers!

[puffyn]

I repost here the following which has been posted in full (with more Wiki links to the relevant documentation at the Proclamations Page (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proclamations))

Fellow Wyrms:

On Turn 74, a sneaking Mictlan army was discovered in Miscya (66) by patrolling Machakan troops and province defense. In the ensuing battle, justice and light prevailed, and the province came under the control of Mictlan. This turn (75), Machaka attacked this province, without obtaining a council resolution supporting his action or coming to a separate private agreement with me. This is a blatant violation of Rule 2 of the Council Charter, which automatically invokes Rule 8. Therefore, subject to judicial oversight to verify the truth of my story (should the great dragon dispute it), Machaka should be considered a rogue nation until and unless he is reinstated by the council.

The issue of discovered sneaking armies has been debated before the council in Proposition4 in which a proposal to require sneakily acquired provinces to be returned was defeated. Additional discussion was held on the board, mostly on these two pages (1) (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=383484&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=31&fpart=23&vc=1) and (2) (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=383484&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=31&fpart=24&vc=1)

The rules as plainly stated in the charter and interpreted in the afore-referenced discussions clearly require council permission before the retaking of a province. A few turns ago, another stealthy army of mine was discovered in a province with a fort, and again took control. In order to avoid entanglements, I agreed to return this province to Machaka, but this referred only to that one particular instance (note that by Rule 13 of the charter, this province was technically in contention and so either side could have legally brought additional force to bear).

We solicit Wyrmly comments on this important issue. (Pulls up a chair and grabs a virgin margarita to drink while watching the discussion).

[Wish]

wow, thats quite an interesting conundrum, It seems unfair to allow the overturn of provinces just because stealth was used, infact I was under the impression that stealth actions where only allowed as long as they did not result in the loss of province...

I will have to think on this matter some more

[shovah]

puffyn said:
I repost here the following which has been posted in full (with more Wiki links to the relevant documentation at the <a href="http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proclamations">Proclamations Page</a>)

Fellow Wyrms:

On Turn 74, a sneaking Mictlan army was discovered in Miscya (66) by patrolling Machakan troops and province defense. In the ensuing battle, justice and light prevailed, and the province came under the control of Mictlan. This turn (75), Machaka attacked this province, without obtaining a council resolution supporting his action or coming to a separate private agreement with me. This is a blatant violation of Rule 2 of the Council Charter, which automatically invokes Rule 8. Therefore, subject to judicial oversight to verify the truth of my story (should the great dragon dispute it), Machaka should be considered a rogue nation until and unless he is reinstated by the council.

The issue of discovered sneaking armies has been debated before the council in Proposition4 in which a proposal to require sneakily acquired provinces to be returned was defeated. Additional discussion was held on the board, mostly on these two pages <a href="http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=383484&page=0&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=31&fpart=23&vc=1">(1)</a> and <a href="http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=383484&page=0&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=31&fpart=24&vc=1">(2)</a>

The rules as plainly stated in the charter and interpreted in the afore-referenced discussions clearly require council permission before the retaking of a province. A few turns ago, another stealthy army of mine was discovered in a province with a fort, and again took control. In order to avoid entanglements, I agreed to return this province to Machaka, but this referred only to that one particular instance (note that by Rule 13 of the charter, this province was technically in contention and so either side could have legally brought additional force to bear).

We solicit Wyrmly comments on this important issue. (Pulls up a chair and grabs a virgin margarita to drink while watching the discussion).



I apologise. From my (apparently wrong) memory of the rules i thought it was within my rights to do so

ps i havnt seen the turn yet, only getting it now

[Ygorl]

I recommend that any further discussion of this matter be moved to the Wiki (which I think is the proper place for in-character public discussion - this forum I think should be for out-of-character discussion of the game, announcements, administration, etc...)

Feel free to ignore me though.

[shovah]

i tend to http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif
your gems (and a few extra for the wait) are on their way just to let you know (currently resting in your email probably)

also, (just to make sure before looking stupider than usual) i can post a proposition but not vote cant I??

[Ygorl]

The way I read the Charter, only Wyrms can post propositions. I think you'll have to find a sponsor.

Also, I'll be hosting in about six hours. Still missing turns from C'tis, Mictlan, and T'ien Ch'i. I wouldn't be tremendously surprised if Puffyn were waiting to see what shovah does before issuing (possibly cataclysmic) orders to his armies. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/eek.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[shovah]

well "If you select a non-wyrm pretender, you will never have a vote. Worshipers of dead Wyrms and dragons (living or dead) may send a representative to the Council. " by my interpretation says otherwise.

[Ygorl]

But then there's:

4A. Creating a Proposal

Propositions must be worded so that the choices are either yes or no. Each proposition is sponsored by one Wyrm, who must be alive at the time the proposition is introduced.


Of course, I've got no authority... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Maybe the chairwyrm should clear things up for good; or, since the chairwyrm has some vested interests, the vice-chairwyrm?

It really does seem pretty straightforward to me though. Living wyrms can propose and vote. Dead wyrms and dragons can discuss. But if it's a reasonable proposition, it shouldn't be too hard to get a wyrm to sponsor it - especially with appropriate gifts http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif. Or you could try to work things out with Puffyn/Apep directly.

[shovah]

hmm, conundrum

[Reverend Zombie]

I'll happily sponsor and and all props...for a small fee.

PM Me (Arco)

[Cainehill]

So - is the consensus that Machaka is currently rogue?

[shovah]

if so then im resending my turn with changes http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Ygorl]

It's not clear whether Apep is going to prosecute roguehood. I think Puffyn is waiting to see what shovah does, as the ball is very much in Astairr's court. My feeling, based on what he's said so far, is that he's very much willing to work, but in the absence of any gestures from Astairr, Apep will prosecute.

Speculating wildly, I'd say he's going to wait until right up to the deadline; if nothing's happened, he'll either decide to prosecute and attack massively this turn, or else he'll decide to let another turn pass before attacking.

So, shovah, I'd say you've got about an hour, maybe a bit more, to either get a message to Puffyn directly or else get a proposition up. That's if you want to play it safe, anyway. These discussions might have resulted in enough uncertainty that he'll be willing to wait another turn, but there's no telling. Or, you could decide that roguehood is the way to go, and launch an attack of your own. I've seen some of Mictlan's armies, though, and they're pretty fearsome. I recommend you talk to him (or at least get someone to put up a proposition for you that clarifies your position).

Or, if there's enough interest (and nobody objects) I guess I could postpone hosting until this gets a little more resolved. I dunno. What do you folks think?

[djo]

Do not postpone! Let blood flow if it must!

(Also, I will be out of town for a few days...I will not stale, if and only if the hosting schedule remains intact!)

I will have King James email his neighbor Vyrmin with a proxy vote should this matter come before the council.

[Ygorl]

Then I'll host tonight. Definitely by 9pm EDT, possibly by 8.

[puffyn]

No need to redo your turn shovah. Mwhahahahahahahahah ha

ha

ha

Uh, that is, we are not attacking this turn, except to take back our province. Nonetheless, it is our opinion that you are currently rogue, and reserve the right to attack next turn, should our discussions not be... productive.

Our turn will be sent to Ygorl shortly.

[Cainehill]

Seems the consensus is to give Machaka a turn to work things out before declaring him rogue. Time to get an army ready though http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Ygorl]

The new turn is out. C'tis stalled again.
I think it's time to start looking for a replacement (or indefinite sub). This makes, I think, seven stalls in a row. What do y'all think?

[Sedna]

Hey kids,

This game is too much fun to watch. And since Yarnspinners 2 is almost finished I'd be happy to take over for C'tis, even if it's just temporarily until the true Wyrm can return.

[Ygorl]

Sedna, send me your email address... Does anyone have any objections to Sedna managing/taking over for Huntsman?

[Cainehill]

No problems here - sounds like perfect solution at least for the interim. And Sedna should have _lots_ of gold to spend on bribes, or at least gems. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Huntsman]

Hi guys,

I'm glad you guys found a sub and I'm sorry for lagging. I was absolutely loving this game when i had the time to role-play and work on the wiki but my life has changed dramatically since then and I no longer have the time or the energy.

With luck things will smooth out and I'll be able to get back to some gaming when Dom 3 comes out!

Thanks again and good luck to all!

Paul/Huntsman

[Sedna]

Raarrrrr, Grundle LIVES!

Don't worry Hunstman, I'll kill 'em all for you.

Can I ask a favor of my neighbors? Drop me a quick note if you had an pre-existing agreements with C'tis. If I'm going to break those I want to do it conciously. My e-mail is a gmail account with sedna17.

[puffyn]

Ugh, Sedna, there goes the neighborhood http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Er, just kidding, welcome to the council!

-puffyn

[Wish]

to your south we, of jotunhiem, have no pre existing agreements save the relative peace imposed by the honourable council standing.

[shovah]

im starting to worry, puffyn still hasnt replied to my pm.

[Huntsman]

Sedna said:
Raarrrrr, Grundle LIVES!

Don't worry Hunstman, I'll kill 'em all for you.

Can I ask a favor of my neighbors? Drop me a quick note if you had an pre-existing agreements with C'tis. If I'm going to break those I want to do it conciously. My e-mail is a gmail account with sedna17.



I was everybody's friend! No open hostilities whatsoever, but if you read back a bit in the council business page you'll see that Pangaea and I had a small gripe against Man. Man wasn't happy that i took Yellow Mts after promising the province to him but he was HUGE anyway! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[puffyn]

Sadly, shovah and I have been unable to come to a mutually agreeable settlement. Negotiations were not helped by catching 5(!) new assassins attempting to sneak into my lands last turn.

</public service announcement>

[Ygorl]

Awaiting turns from Abysia, C'tis, Machaka, Pythium, and Ulm. I've heard from C'tis, though, and the rest of y'all have historically been reliable. We might have a full set of turns for once!

If I get them all by around 4:50, I will host then. Otherwise, I won't be able to host until around midnight. If this causes problems for anyone, of course, let me hear it.

[shovah]

I am officially rogue as declared by myself, as i have neither the will to sort this out with puffyn nor the patience to go through a long, diplomatic proccess to get out i see this as the best option for myself (and my neighbours who can get my lands ofcourse) also note that any of my neighbours on peaceful terms with myself need not fear attacks atleast for this turn so no need to resend.

[Sedna]

Hey Puffyn,

Why is the wiki so slow?

[shovah]

can i ask for a hosting delay, just a few hours.

[Ygorl]

Read the message three above yours, and you'll get your answer. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[shovah]

well my turns in (being rougue takes ages)

ps: grab my provinces fast guys, i really doubt i can hold puffyn back for more than a few turns at most.

[Ygorl]

A new turn is out.

[shovah]

joy, i cant wait to see what sorry state my empire is in.

[Wish]

Im on it!

[shovah]

fun turn

[Cainehill]

The Evil Machakans attacked me! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[shovah]

lol, it was 1 half dead (unridden) black spider lord and 1 heavy cav.

[Sedna]

Yay, war!

Hey guys, wait for meeeeeeeeeeeee...

I'm coming as fast as my little lizard legs can.

[Ygorl]

Go lizard legs!

I think I will be able to host properly this evening. So, with 5.5 hours left, I need turns from Atlantis, Jotunheim, Machaka, Marignon, and Ulm.

[shovah]

my turns in.

[Ygorl]

Yup. Just waiting on Whollaborg. I'm heading out to tackle the Windy City, so the turn might not host until late tonight, but tonight it will host.

[shovah]

why do I have to live in the UK(its midnight atm)

[shovah]

HOLY ****. that was one hell of a turn, took me about half an hours (maybe more) to watch those battles (at fast speed+occasionally using n)
my forces are depleteing quickly as planned and mictlan isnt gaining much ground. this turn i knocked a reasonably sized chunk out of apeps army (though obviously nowhere near enough), winning a cataclysmic battle that was a phyric (sp?) victory. took out an arch devil and a heliophagi (hint hint, summon them) but in total this turn iirc 3 ice devils, belial and a heliophagi survived my many battles. ive definetely learn the power of massed mages (15 or so backed by a huge meat shield of vine ogres and a few heavy hitters)

special thanks to mr lizard legs for finally getting here (though you need more skele raisers)

[Wish]

to be honest, I was hoping you wouldn't put up such a fight http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[shovah]

the funny thing is that any attacks i made against you were accidents while manuvering troops to mictlan.

[Wish]

yeah, hopefully that monster of an army has moved on! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[shovah]

the 200 or so strong army of ogres and fire things led by 2 fire kings and 15 good mages? yea its into mictlan land now.

[puffyn]

shovah said:
the 200 or so strong army of ogres and fire things led by 2 fire kings and 15 good mages? yea its into mictlan land now.



Or what's left of it... as you say, a dramatic and close battle. There'll be blood spilt aplenty this turn.

[Ygorl]

I wish I could watch... Well, I'm saving all the turns, so when all is done maybe we can get the master password from Alneyan and all sit down with some popcorn.

[Ygorl]

Waiting for turns from Machaka, Mictlan, T'ien Ch'i, Ulm, and Vanheim. Hosting in about 8.5 hours.

[shovah]

puffyn said:

shovah said:
the 200 or so strong army of ogres and fire things led by 2 fire kings and 15 good mages? yea its into mictlan land now.



Or what's left of it... as you say, a dramatic and close battle. There'll be blood spilt aplenty this turn.



yes, as soon as i posted that those were my thoughts.

[Ygorl]

Still no turn from T'ien Ch'i.

[PashaDawg]

Just sent my turn in.

[Ygorl]

Wow, even if there weren't a war on that would have been an exciting turn! It's not often that a nation steals a *second* casting of the Arcane Nexus!

Bravely done, Folket! How long did it take you to save up the pearls? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

This was also an exciting turn because it was the first time that the archive with the fthrlnd, .chk, .trn, and .2h files exceeded 1000KB! Play on!

[shovah]

fun turn, as i know my death is imminent(this turn or next most likely) every single unit i own capable of offensive action has been mustered to fight, every mage capable of casting a spell againt the vile apep has been order to do so (if you would like to do the same i suggest targeting Pranda (62) where his large armie (atleast one of them) are and Gol Phalas (44) where there are 4 units consisting mainly of ice devils) there are also a few random attacks/seige breakers from those who are far away from my enemy. TODAY, WE GO TO WAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ps: watch out ctis, your sitting on my capitol and all my lower ranked mages are there. (theres a hell of alot of them and they could pack a punch)

[Ygorl]

Would anybody be interested in receiving an email when I get your turn? I know Panther had mentioned something like this in another thread, so I'll assume he would unless I hear otherwise. Anyone else?

[Cainehill]

Wouldn't be a bad thing - lets the players know their turn was received. I've had a few stales from lost emails; think CoA we can get a return-receipt (sometimes hours late, but still good to know).

[Ygorl]

For some reason, Apple's Mail.app doesn't do anything with the automated I-got-it receipts that you've been putting on your emails. It's only when I get them in Seamonkey (nee Mozilla) that you get your confirmation (which is presumably part of the reason that you get them late, sometimes after hosting).
I'll add you to the list.

[puffyn]

Ygorl, please add me to the list for confirmation emails.

Also, as a friendly service announcement to my fellow wyrms, I wouldn't really recommend casting nasty artillery spells at Pranda, unless your mages are expendable*. Just saying.

-Apep

* I guess this applies to all of Machaka's mages, so cast your heart out, shovah.

[Wish]

pranda?

[Ygorl]

I've got turns from everyone except Abysia and T'ien Ch'i. Exciting!

Er, and Pythium. Right. Sorry RonD. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif
That dang "pangaea.trn" looks an awful lot like "pythium.2h" if you squint just right and ignore the color of the icon...

[RonD]

Ygorl said:
I've got turns from everyone except Abysia and T'ien Ch'i. Exciting!



Really? I wonder who played my turn for me? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/eek.gif

[shovah]

puffyn said:
Ygorl, please add me to the list for confirmation emails.

Also, as a friendly service announcement to my fellow wyrms, I wouldn't really recommend casting nasty artillery spells at Pranda, unless your mages are expendable*. Just saying.

-Apep

* I guess this applies to all of Machaka's mages, so cast your heart out, shovah.



well since the only dangerous dome i can currently think of is the dome of flaming death or the blood one which is dangerous to more than just the enemy combined with the fact that im going to die soon anyway means it dosnt bother me at the very least (come on guys, take my provinces faster)

[The_Tauren13]

I really don't have time for dominions anymore, and especially not this game....

[Morkilus]

The summer seems to be killing off all our younger players... I assume you're all not playing Oblivion instead http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Ygorl]

Camp Crystal Lake... or maybe finals... or maybe not-sitting-in-front-of-a-computer when it's lovely outside...

Tauren, does this mean you need a replacement? I know I still owe you a Council vote, and I know I'm not alone in that... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Wish]

I just finished finals, but the hwole not sitting on computer thing seems appealing

[The_Tauren13]

Well, the thing is, I go to school and work from 8AM to midnight... however, I get off school in just about a month, so I should have plently of time for Dominions then. If I can just stick it out until then, I should be able to pick back up where I left off here, and maybe get something interesting going. I just thought I'd offer an explanation for my stales, lack of involvement, and submitting partially-played turns... However, while I don't really need a sub, if anyone wouldn't mind temp subbing for the next month so the great nation of t'ien Ch'i doesn't go completely to seed, that would be cool.

[shovah]

feel free to target prandra (62) with spells. either the dome is weaker than he thought or he bluffed because theres either no dome or a dome of frost (cant remember which of my mages cast at it) and since it only releases a little frost blast and has only 30% chance of stopping the spell cast through it (my crystal mage survived http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif) i think its worth it (over 200 troops including a huge number of devils and demon knights, father illearth, belial, a fallen angel, an arch angel and a bunch of summoned mages) and dont think im trying to survive because as it is plain for everyone (including apep) to see the graphs show my death at the hands of others if not by him

oh and belphagor and some ice devils are in melma (56)

ps: panthers still in this with his 1 province so he can vote right?

[Ygorl]

Waiting for Atlantis, Machaka, Mictlan, T'ien Ch'i, and Ulm. Hosting in 7 hours.

[shovah]

mines in.

[Ygorl]

Lacking only Atlantis... Come on, Whollaborg!

[Ygorl]

Morkilus staled last turn, despite having sent me a .2h file. I just looked, and even though he sent me a .2h file for this turn, Vanheim is not showing up as having been played when I open the game on my computer (i.e. there's no hyphen in the list of nations when I start playing the game).
I just emailed him to make sure that he sent me a .2h file from turn 80; I'm going to delay hosting until I hear from him.

If anyone has any suggestions, I'd welcome them.


So I just looked at the .chk files for this turn (80, not yet run) and the last turn (79, of course). Both of them, Vanheim's .2h shows up as being for turn 78 (though, without error for that turn). Either Morkilus isn't playing off the right .trn file, or else something funny is going on. I haven't heard back from him yet; has anyone seen this kind of turn mis-numbering due to a corrupted file or anything?

[PashaDawg]

Here's my three cents:

Sometimes a file just won't work, even if it is resent. Usually, it ends up working if the player sends that particular turn as a zip. (I hate getting zips as the host, but sometimes that's all that will work for a particular turn file. There are probably little pixies in the system somewhere who twist up turn files every so often. It usually happens when the player is from Rhode Island, because they talk funny down there.)

[Cainehill]

Could be a windows cache bug : Often times, MS Windows puts a file into memory cache, and doesn't properly invalidate the cache when the file is updated on disk. Run into this both as a programmer and gamer.

[Ygorl]

Zip files actually don't slow me down at all, now that I'm using my hyper-patented-mega-cool Applescript folder action. I told Morkilus to re-send as a zip and sent him the .trn file as a zip. This should overcome any pixies or gremlins, and might help with any cache bugs too (if, say, the process of extracting the zipped file gives the OS a kick to say "hey, it's a new file, dummy!")

Still no word from Morkilus, though, which means (unfortunately) that the turn might not go out tonight. We'll have to wait and see, I guess...

[Morkilus]

Sorry guys, I goofed... no need to send the turn as a zip, I just need to make sure I'm pointing to the right directory. Ygorl should have my turn. Sorry to make things late.

[Ygorl]

Hosted and sent. Whollaborg still staled, unfortunately. The next turn will be due on Thursday, to give folks time to play this one.

[Ygorl]

Waiting only for Abysia.

[Ygorl]

Astairr the Red, the deadliest being in the history of the world, has perished. Machaka is still holding on by a fingernail, but it's looking pretty terminal for the spider-guys.

[Reverend Zombie]

Arcoscephale has a new proposition up.

[shovah]

im just glad that alot of people got more benefit from my death than mictlan did (cant remember, who got capitol?)

[Wish]

looks like ctis

I personally made a B-line for the two unfortified victory points.

[shovah]

thought it was ctis, aby and marignon also got a bit (marignon more than aby)

[djo]

C'tis earned the capital, from the first battle I saw.

We of marignon got 3 provinces, 2 with nice forts.

[shovah]

who got the crystal mage province and who got the circle master province (golems summoners and circle masters, yay)

[djo]

I got the crystal mages. Or, I am besieging them, anyway.

I don't think I got the other one...unless I'm very inobservant.

[shovah]

crystal mages are north of capitol iirc, i think the circle masters are east (ctis maybe?)

[PashaDawg]

Greetings Wyrms!

I will be out of town Saturday - Monday due to the holiday weekend. Would it be possible to postpone the hosting until Monday?

Pasha

[Ygorl]

No problem. Or, since you've got your turn in already, what if I just host as usual and possibly postpone the next hosting? Or, do you want to be around to make sure some funny proposition doesn't pass that would change your turn?

Let me know what you want, and I'll do it. I'm pliable that way.

[puffyn]

Speaking of which, voting on Proposition 38 closes in two hours. It is currently tied (5 Yes, 5 No, and 1 Abstain) with a quorum of votes, which means it is set to pass.

[RonD]

I was hoping my abstention would lead to large tie-breaker bribe offers.

Well???????

[Wish]

why would they need to bribe with the prop set to pass?

[RonD]

If everyone wanted it to pass, it wouldn't be tied, would it?

[RonD]

B'ang!Pat'h is currently convinced that this proposal is a bad idea.

Though anything more than 5 gems and 100 gold would probably be a sufficient argument in the other direction....

[PashaDawg]

Ygorl said:
No problem. Or, since you've got your turn in already, what if I just host as usual and possibly postpone the next hosting? Or, do you want to be around to make sure some funny proposition doesn't pass that would change your turn?

Let me know what you want, and I'll do it. I'm pliable that way.



I would like Sunday's hosting delayed to Monday night, because I might want to change my turn!!

Thanks. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Reverend Zombie]

I believe Proposition 38 has passed and have updated the wiki accordingly (apologies if I should not have done that).

We have a quorum, and 6 yea vs. 6 nay votes.

[PashaDawg]

I do note that proposition 38 is meaningless. It specifically states that the armies of "Arcoscehphale" can attack, etc. There is no such country. In this instance, spelling counts! The concealed "intent" of the scalawag from Arco is irrelevant. Ulm is ready to take this to the highest court if necessary. Any attack purusant to the proposition shall render such attacking nation a Rogue!!

[Ygorl]

I will host Monday night.
Pasha, you must be a lawyer... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif
But what is this "purusant" word that you used? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[djo]

We of Maringeonia agree with our colleague from Oolm. The sacred game of "Dominicans II: The Accretion Ward" shouldst not be demeaned through a lack of good spellling.

[PashaDawg]

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif

DON"T QUESTUN MY SPELING, TURDBALL!!!!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif

<Ahem>

Oooops... my secretary was at lunch. Spelling counts in legal propositions before the Council, but not in this thread. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[RonD]

PashaDawg said:
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif

DON"T QUESTUN MY SPELING, TURDBALL!!!!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif




at leest yoo spelt turdball goodly http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/beerglass.gif

[Reverend Zombie]

PashaDawg said:
I do note that proposition 38 is meaningless. It specifically states that the armies of "Arcoscehphale" can attack, etc. There is no such country. In this instance, spelling counts! The concealed "intent" of the scalawag from Arco is irrelevant. Ulm is ready to take this to the highest court if necessary. Any attack purusant to the proposition shall render such attacking nation a Rogue!!



Spelling has not been standardized in Arcoscephale, and we we frequently refer to our country by a variety of spellings.

[Jurri]

Arcosnuffleupagus is still the preferred and least ambiguous spelling! /threads/images/Graemlins/Running.gif

[Folket]

Well, do you really want to rip apart the council about a spelling? It is not as if people would vote diffrently with an other spelling.

Anyone that want to take this to supreme court over spelling will surly be my enemy and a proposition will be put up in time about total war.

[puffyn]

I'm pretty sure Pasha was just joking about the spelling.

In my capacity as Chairwyrm, I declare that Reverend Zombie correctly certified that Proposition 38 passed and, as such, is now law.

[PashaDawg]

Lord Pasha never jokes!

Technicalities matter before the Council!

Given that the good Chairwyrm voted FOR the proposition and could very well profit by it, it is clear that he is lacking the necessary impartiality to decide the issue. His "declaration" might as well be scribbled on a blood-stained cocktail napkin. <frothing at both mouths>

Furthermore, the Death Wyrm of Ermor also voted FOR the proposition and no doubt is planning to profit by it. Such a deed has already rendered Ulm and Ermor bitter enemies. <pounding left head on table; sputtering with the other>

However, given that the turn hosting has been postponed to Monday, another proposition shall be made soon to rectify the affront to Ulm's sovereignty. <striking a dignified pose of defiance>

And, it is certainly possible that any nation that chooses to attack Ulm pursuant to the offending proposition shall render itself rogue under the terms of the Wyrm Charter.

<sealed with a double-headed drooly-spit mark>

Lord Pasha

[Cainehill]

Perhaps a motion that suggests that _all_ nations are rogue, as we all have armies, and thus are all potential aggressors? I certainly need more wars to counter the .... rumor that the dragon has eaten more gloriously than I.

Vyrmin of Abysia
(Eater of Larger Armies than the Dragon ever Ate)

[Cainehill]

And indeed, should "mere" spelling not matter? If in a formal council proposition I should mispell "war" as "peace", and everyone votes that there should be "peace" between myself and Mictlan for 5 turns, should I be allowed to rage war, simply because other could not properly translate "Piece" as the Abysian word for "war, leaving the other in pieces"?

Vyrmin, notoriously as two-faced as _ALL_ wyrms

[Reverend Zombie]

I of course maintain that all those voting on my proposition new exactly what it was they were voting for or against, various spellings of my nation aside: the right for Arco to attack any province containing an opposing army without Arco being rogue. Any tribunal worth the name would rule in favor of the plain meaning of the proposition and the intent of those voting.

Why make arguments against a proposition prior to its passage if one thinks it a nullity? Better to have saved your breath, yes?

Arguments NOW that the proposition has no effect reek of desperation unseemly in neighbors so much stronger than tiny Arco.

Insofar as this useless post facto debate adds uncertainty in the minds of my neighbors, or gives them false hope that the proposition has no effect, I advise them that the safest course would be for them to remove their armies from provinces adjacent to my own.

Else face the consequences, and thine OWN roguehood. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

[PashaDawg]

The Great Pretenderate of Ulm hereby relents on the issue of spelling.

Proposition 39 has been posted for the consideration of the Council.

Lord Pasha

[PashaDawg]

Oh! Proposition 39 was intentionally drafted so that it would benefit the Good, Noble, Peaceful Pretenderate of Arco. to vote in favor of it, too.

[puffyn]

This is a friendly service reminder that voting on Proposition 39 (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition39) is open for roughly another 12 hours (until 9:35 EDT on May 29th). This is because the proposition is a weekend proposition.

Currently, there are 7 votes, which constitutes a quorum.

[puffyn]

Proposition 39 has passed.

[Ygorl]

Waiting for Ermor, Mictlan, and Vanheim. I'll host at around 8 tonight.

[PashaDawg]

Now that turn 39 has passed, I would suggest that we refer to the nations that voted in favor of the proposition as "pro-proposition 39" nations (aka PP39 nations for short). This might prove useful. (I hope it proves useful.)

Lord Pasha

[Ygorl]

OK, who dispelled my Gift?

[Sedna]

Yeah! Suck on it succubus!

(addressed to my fine neighbor, Jotunheim)

[Ygorl]

I almost want Puffyn to annihilate me, so I get a lovely ode of my own.

[Folket]

Seems like only me, Vanheim and Atlantis are not free for everyone else to attack. Seems like going rouge will is no longer an option given that you may attack allmost anyone anyway.

An intresting point of proposition 39 is that if Ermor, Vanheim or Atlantis decleare war on a PP39 with a council vote, all PP39 nations may attack them but they will not be allowed to attack back.

Seems like I´m out of internet as well, but I will try to get my turn done.

[PashaDawg]

Yes, that's a great Ode to the Red Dragon!

[RonD]

Ygorl said:
OK, who dispelled my Gift?



Uh, whom do we suppose might have the astral resources to do such a thing?

[Ygorl]

One could still declare war with a proposition that suspends Proposition 39; it's not as though 39 is immune to future amendments, retractions, or suspensions. In a way, Prop. 39 doesn't do anything except make it a bit more inconvenient to get a proposition for war passed (well, aside from the parts of it that nullify parts of Prop. 38). Doesn't seem like that big a deal to me; the only way it would have been interesting would be if Rev. Zombie had been around to vote on it and had voted yes.

[Ygorl]

I know you don't mean Ermor, because Ermor staled...
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/mad.gif


RonD said:

Ygorl said:
OK, who dispelled my Gift?



Uh, whom do we suppose might have the astral resources to do such a thing?

[Wish]

yeah, she was never designed to take out my fellow wyrms.

[Reverend Zombie]

All Wyrms should note that Arcoscephale has signed on to passed Proposition 39 following B'hemet's return from Holy Day celebration.

[Wish]

was it still open at the time? I mean do votes count after it ha s closed and passed?

[PashaDawg]

Lord Pasha is happy to allow Arco to add its support to Prop 39. After all, it would make war much more interesting!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[puffyn]

Since Pasha is in favor, I'm inclined to let Arco slide on the time limit (due to the holiday) this time, unless somebody objects.

[Cainehill]

But ... doesn't that make fewer armies I can eat???

[Wish]

yes, it does. I am tempted to put something out there to make the prospect of war less confusing

[PashaDawg]

It means that all Wyrms that voted in favor can attack Arco, but that those same Wyrms (including Arco's Wyrm) can counter-attack. For example, Ulm and Abysia might attack Arco. But, then Arco and T.C. can counter-attack, etc., but then Mictlan, Man and Pythium can attack T.C. for attacking Abysia and Ulm, etc.

Sounds like Vyrmin will have many, many things to eat!

[Wish]

so basically it very nearly degenerates the council - or rather makes the diplomatic peace insanely fragile, in regards to arco.

[PashaDawg]

'Tis Time For War! A messy, nasty war!!

[Ygorl]

Hosting tonight. I still don't have turns from Arcoschluffleupple, Atlantis, Ermor, Jotunheim, or Machaka.

[Reverend Zombie]

Ygorl said:
Hosting tonight. I still don't have turns from Arcoschluffleupple, Atlantis, Ermor, Jotunheim, or Machaka.



Arco here. I thought I sent mine, but I'll try to transmit (again?) before hosting.

[Ygorl]

I never got it. I'll wait for you.

[Cainehill]

In this month was great treachery done. Someone _shall_ be eaten.

Chuzrael, sometime war prophet of Vyrmin, caster of Earth Blod Well and Fiery pits.

[Ygorl]

What happened? I was just about to comment that it seemed like a really uneventful turn...

[Wish]

someone overcast the earth blood deep well

[PashaDawg]

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif Storm clouds are gathering over Arco! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

[Cainehill]

Over Arco? I have to read that latest proposition and see if it allows Abysia to war against Ulm.

[Ygorl]

Wish, I cast my Gift of Health over Pythium's EBDW. The GoH was promptly dispelled (by nefarious ne'erdowells unknown, but sure to suffer once they are revealed!) and Cainehill filled the gap with an EBDW of his own. I don't think the treachery Cainehill's talking about is any of that?

But... Cainehill? Care to share?

[Reverend Zombie]

Cainehill said:

Over Arco? I have to read that latest proposition and see if it allows Abysia to war against Ulm.



Since Arco was allowed as a signatory, if anyone has attacked me, any other signatories can attack Arco's attacker(s) (who may then in turn be attacked by other signatories) thus triggering the Apocalypse.

And it's about time, isn't it? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/firedevil.gif

[djo]

Reverend Zombie said:
thus triggering the Apocalypse.



I thought that was my other game (yarnspinners2)!

I thought it was amusing that Prop 39 allows someone to attack Arco, then defend Arco (and also attack themselves, if they like (*)).

(*) But unfortunately, the game does not support this option.

[puffyn]

I would caution (PP39) Wyrms to verify that they are allowed to attack under 39 before launching an assault. There are still substantial benefits to being in the council (I believe), and mistakenly attacking another Wyrm before you are allowed to (i.e., before they attack someone else) will result in automatic roguehood.

I have an urge to make a little chart showing who has attacked who under the allowance of 39-- but that's uncessary, I'll just start a subpage on the wiki. I always wanted to use the "Treaty" page:

<a href ="http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Treaties">http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Treaties</a>

[Cainehill]

Ygorl said:
Wish, I cast my Gift of Health over Pythium's EBDW. The GoH was promptly dispelled (by nefarious ne'erdowells unknown, but sure to suffer once they are revealed!) and Cainehill filled the gap with an EBDW of his own. I don't think the treachery Cainehill's talking about is any of that?

But... Cainehill? Care to share?



Note that the greatest devourer of armies slew himself this month, while popping into a province that he had been invited to visit. In a fit of pique over having to eat undead, Vyrmin did retreat into hostile lands in order to purge his stomach of the nasty meal.

[PashaDawg]

Vyrmin was invited by Ulm to a special dinner party in his honor. Unfortunately, Lord Pasha served up too much food for even Vyrmin's two heads. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rant.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rant.gif

[Ygorl]

Oooh, sounds scandalous!

With hosting probably about 9-10 hours away (yes, a bit late) I'm missing turns from Atlantis, Ermor, Jotunheim, and Machaka.

[shovah]

you dont need my turn, im completely destroyed.

[Folket]

My turn is being played at the moment. I saw that Vyrmin was over his heads with bonefiends.

[Folket]

Sent now. Zona Nyl will enjoy seeing you fight eachother to death.

[djo]

I, Jack of Marignon, noticed that there are only 4 wyrms in the Hall of Fame who haven't died yet (I, of course, am one of them, being too pretty to die).

I challenge each of the others (Ygorl, Apep, and B'ang!Pat'h) to take a pledge: that should they die, they will pay 20 gems (of whatever color) to each of the others left alive (who also took the pledge). Should another wyrm make it into the Hall, they would be entitled to take the same pledge, for the same risks and benefits.

What do you say? Are you wyrms or poodles in wyrm's clothing? I, of course, enter my name (and that of my brother, Jacques) into this contest. Who dares to follow?

[PashaDawg]

You are so funny, djo! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Cainehill]

Jack of Marignon, as the most recent to die : _I_ am no poodle. May we expand the bet so that, should you and I butt heads, no council business is broken, but twenty gems is at stake?

Chuzrael, focusing a seance for Vyrmin

[Wish]

Lormungand has never died, but has been ill for most of the game. to ill to over eat lesser beings without getting a sore stomach.

[djo]

Cainehill said:
Jack of Marignon, as the most recent to die : _I_ am no poodle. May we expand the bet so that, should you and I butt heads, no council business is broken, but twenty gems is at stake?



My brother's attention span is limited, as is his valor. He has disappeared to go drinking, but I will uphold our honor: should we cross paths with our hitherto gregarious neighbor Vyrmin, a side bet of 20 gems shall lie on the results.

Jacques du Marignon, Caelum, et Machaka du nord

[Ygorl]

Waiting for Aby, Arco, Erm, T'ien, Ulm. Hosting tonight some time after 8.

[Cainehill]

Sent Aby this morning, also re-sent this afternoon.

[PashaDawg]

Fellow Wyrms:

In a purely defensive preemptive police action, national commando units of the Great Pretenderate of Ulm crossed into Acro this last turn to destroy a temple on the border shared by Ulm and Arco. Ulm spies had uncovered semi-reliable evidence that Arco religious fanatics were using the temple to plan acts of aggression to be carried out within Ulm territory.

This police action was carried out under the authority granted to Ulm under this Council's Proposition 39.

Lord Pasha

[Reverend Zombie]

PashaDawg said:
Fellow Wyrms:

In a purely defensive preemptive police action, national commando units of the Great Pretenderate of Ulm crossed into Acro this last turn to destroy a temple on the border shared by Ulm and Arco. Ulm spies had uncovered semi-reliable evidence that Arco religious fanatics were using the temple to plan acts of aggression to be carried out within Ulm territory.

This police action was carried out under the authority granted to Ulm under this Council's Proposition 39.

Lord Pasha



I confirm this dastardly strike by the Ulmish scum! Note that Ulm may now be attacked by all other Prop 39 signatories. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

[Ygorl]

Missing Atlantis, Pangaea, T'ien Ch'i, and Vanheim. Hosting tonight.

[Sedna]

Please vote "yes" on friendly-happy-Proposition 40 (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition40).

Belgium!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

[Morkilus]

The much more reasonable Proposition 41 (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition41) is up for votes. Notice the much more enticing bribe!

[The Panther]

Morkilus said:
The much more reasonable Proposition 41 (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition41) is up for votes. Notice the much more enticing bribe!



Don't you mean the much LESS reasonable Proposition 41?

[Sedna]

YAP (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition42) (Yet Another Proposition)

[Folket]

There is great activity at the council. Proposition 43 is ready for your votes.

[Sedna]

Because it is a weekend proposition, there are still 5 more hours to vote on Proposition 42 (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition42). If Atlantis votes I believe this will have the distinction of being the first full-suffrage proposition -- and he is the swing vote.

Note my comment in the Proposition discussion that I am voluntarily not taking the initial 75 gems if this proposition passes. I hope that a few others may join me so that this valuable piece of can pass without forcing Ermor to go rogue.

[Ygorl]

I have all turns except Marignon, Pangaea, Pythium, and T'ien Ch'i. Hosting tonight, maybe even soon after eight.

[Ygorl]

I put up a new proposition!
Familiar, yet different... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Wish]

The summary of the proposition is that Jotunhiem wants in on the C'Tis war action (http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition45)

[Morkilus]

Nice. So, do Pythium and Man wish to join in as well? All together now!

[djo]

We are curious why Jotunheim, in their new proposition, chooses to exempt themselves from Prop 39, when Ermor, when petitioning to join the C'tis-Vanheim war, left themselves open to reprisals.

Were the lizards not filthy disease-carriers, one might begin to feel sorry for them.

[RonD]

Morkilus said:
Nice. So, do Pythium and Man wish to join in as well? All together now!



You were the one who had to have his big brother fight for him. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Sedna]

As a point of order: who decides what a proposition really means? I know there's a process to bring a matter to the chief justice, but is that the first option, or a last resort?

I ask because I'm trying to decipher what Proposition 43 + 39 really mean. My current interpretation is that nothing Vanheim or I do to each other can trigger 39 since authorization for that war came under 40 which exempts 39. However, though Ermor has not directly attacked one of my provinces, the language of 39 is: "shall attack or engage in war against". Proposition 43 is Ermor entering into (i.e. engaging) war against me, and thus I believe he is already a valid target for PP39.

Well, I shall post that on the wiki section and you can comment there, but I'd appreciate any "out-of-character/disinterested" opinions also.

[djo]

Sedna said:
As a point of order: who decides what a proposition really means?



Facetious answer: yes, another proposition!

Serious observation: quite often the discussion here and there reveals what the consensus reading of a proposition is. A follow-up proposition would probably enforce it.

The wyrmly answer: Jacques would like to see an attack (the declaration isn't enough); Jack thinks you don't have to wait for a threat to become a poke in the eye before you act. Marignon would probably abstain, split vote.

[Wish]

eh, I do not wish to war against c'tis and vanhiem and welcome all comers like ermor does. I just don't want to see all that wonderful c'tisian land fall to such as ermor, who already has plenty of land, while I sit and watch and remain small.

Personally I voted for 39 as a deterent, for the added threat it brings on being attacked, not out of support for a clearly insane proposition. I almost want to propose to have it repealed.

Anyway for my own propositions I would like to maintain the increased threat posed by prop 39 to the arcosephale/ulm conflict, and handle my personal conflicts in a traditional manner.

[Cainehill]

*yawn* Can someone let me know who we can attack now? We're bored, and since we died of indigestion we haven't eaten a proper meal/army.

Vyrmin

[Ygorl]

Cainehill, here you go:
http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Treaties


I need turns from Abysia, C'tis, Jotunheim, Mictlan, T'ien Ch'i, and Vanheim.

[Ygorl]

Abysia, Ermor, and T'ien Ch'i still have outstanding turns. I'll host tonight or sooner if I get all three.

[The Panther]

Proposition 46, End of Pangaea Exile, is up for consideration.

http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proposition46

[Wish]

btw I want it to be known that I did not seige C'Tis' capitol and thus am not targetable via prop 39, One of my sneaky types were found, and subsequently won.

[Ygorl]

And Ermor had better send me (and others!) 21 gems this coming turn, or things will get *really* hairy... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Folket]

That seems unreasable. I will send 7 gems for turn 90 and 7 gems for turn 91.

You can't expect that a proposition can force people to do something when passed that late in a turn. I know that I do not have time to constantly observe what is happening.

[Ygorl]

Waiting for turns from Abysia, Atlantis, Ermor, Marignon, Pangaea, T'ien Ch'i, and Vanheim.
Out of breath now.

[The Panther]

Note:

The distribution of Pangaea wealth has been posted on the COW site under proclimations:
http://yarnspinners.improbable.org/Wyrms/index.php?title=Proclamations
Scroll down to the end to read it.

[Ygorl]

Waiting for Aby, Arco, Mict, Pyth, T'ien, Van.

[djo]

In the wiki under proclamations, Vanheim asked:


Man has attacked my provinces. Since I haven't attacked anybody yet, including C'tis, aren't I NOT a nation valid to be attacked by the cruelly unfair Proposition 39? Does this make Man rogue?



As a neighbor of Man, we wonder if there are comments and/or more details from the involved parties.

[Ygorl]

[Grimbald, chief interpreter of the council rulings, speaks up]

"This was a carefully considered move, not undertaken lightly nor without much inspection of the Charter and its amendments. When Ermor moved armies into Vanheim's provinces, they ceased to belong to Vanheim and became 'under contention', co-owned by both Vanheim and Ermor. Since attacks on Ermor are allowed by Proposition 39, we sent forces in to disperse the river of undead flowing into C'tissian lands.

"I see that the Wyrm of C'tis has posted much the same explanation (as well as a counter to Vanheim's claims of innocence) in the Hall of Proclamations. I suggest that we move future discussion of this issue to that more-appropriate forum. I will bring notice of this matter to my Liege Ygorl."

[Wish]

it would indeed make him rogue

[Ygorl]

On an entirely different note, I'll be out of town Wednesday-Sunday, so I won't host Thursday (and I will probably be a bit late on Sunday).

[Wish]

one should note, since ermor voted no, they are not attackable under prop 39.

[Ygorl]

I don't think that's right. We 39ers are allowed to attack "any Nation or Pretenderate that shall attack or engage in war against Ulm or any Pretenderate or Nation ruled by any Council Wyrm that votes in favor of this proposition."

I would probably have acted differently, otherwise... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Anyway, it almost seems like you've got a grievance against me... Sheesh! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif