Problems in demo exist in regular game?

[Edi]

TruePurple:

You misunderstand. The DB file is essentially still a spreadsheet (even though it will be made so that it can be converted to an SQL DB), it doesn't access anything from the game files themselves. It's all put in there by hand, but because it gives more information than anything else in an easily accessible format, it allows modders to look at what they like to change and to easily implement those changes. That's why it's mod friendly. But it's not an add-on program to the game. It's just documentation.

As for JK and KO, they are cool guys. They might not implement everything we want, but they do keep an eye on the forum. You also have a misplaced idea about just how much planning has gone to the mechanics. The manual is absolutely brim-full of mechanics and their explanations that are enough to make most strategy gamers' heads spin. There's more meat in Dominions even in that area than in most other games

As for your complaints about

1) Enemy numbers estimates: The way it's done in Dominions 3 is realistic. You get a rough estimate that may or may not be accurate, but you can't expect to have precise info. That is the REALITY of ALL battlefields throughout history. The estimates are never less than 50% or more than 200% of the actual figure.

2) Number of prophets: Enslaving or charming another god's prophet means that that unit became an apostate and switched sides. He used to be the holy figure of another rival god but has now seen the truth and changed sides. Arguably pretty damned inspiring from the common grunt's point of view, hence he remains a prophet. The reason why you don't also get to strip prophet status willy-nilly is the same thematically, it's not good for the peons to have their revered religious figures arbitrarily stripped of their status. Besides, there is an expectation that sooner or later prophets get killed. Then you nominate a new one.


3) Not allowing to dismiss units: There isn't a mechanism for that, which can be annoying, but the usual way to do it is use them for fodder or send them on a suicide mission. You've hired them and they'll stick by you, you don't just get to dump them in a ditch.

Arguably, AoW (the original) had a cool way of going about dismissal: all such units became independents, and they could be a real pain in the arse. In AoW2 and AoW:SM dismissal is instadeath, which was stupid. There's pros and cons to all of these approaches.

As for playing Dominions 3, it's not work unless you take it too seriously. No disrespect intended, but it seems to me a rather arrogant approach to come to the forum and just with your opening posts make a pretty hefty list of demands that the game be molded to suit your personal desires, especially when you take into account the character of the game and the number of people Illwinter has (2).

If this game is not something you enjoy, particularly if you've only tried the demo and already know it isn't for you, move on. Otherwise you should accept at least some of the main things about the game.

Edi

[TruePurple]

edi said:
]Enemy numbers estimates: The way it's done in Dominions 3 is realistic. You get a rough estimate that may or may not be accurate, but you can't expect to have precise info. That is the REALITY of ALL battlefields throughout history. The estimates are never less than 50% or more than 200% of the actual figure.

You misunderstand me.

If the game kept track of the random number and gave you a average of that number.. Like lets say first turn the game says there are 20 troops. Next turn it gives and average of 70 troops. But because of the 20 troop figure the turn before it gives you an average guess of 35. Next turn it randomizes 50 troops figure. But because of the 20 & 70 numbers of the turns before it gives you a number thats an average of all 3 numbers.(additionally under the random number or in replace of it)

Such assumes the scout has an IQ number high enough to rub together and start a fire (2 )that he could work out averages. But makes sense in alot of ways both for game play and game reasoning (the longer you observe troops, the better you know their numbers) Yes players can keep track of and average these numbers but who wants to bother with that kind of work when playing?

edi said:
In AoW2 and AoW:SM dismissal is instadeath, which was stupid

The units don't "die" they go back to the population. Just like when you recruit units, your not bringing them to life. Your recruiting them from the population. So AoW2's dismissal is not "instadeath" and works fine. Not to mention being much simpler to program then them turning indie I figure. Better too IMO.

Speaking of, I like caring about my population and troops in a game. Dominions forcing one to go through the effort of putting units on suicide missions say if you want a new prophet because you got a much better unit a turn after you finally decided to put it on a more regular unit. Or because a unit is dreadfully crippled yet with all your powers you can't tell that unit "your fired" (like you see alot of cripples [aside from fresh cripples of course]on medieval battlefields.. or any battlefields for that matter)

Because of that dominion makes it much harder to reach that feeling. And so unforgiving & so much work.

As far as me sounding arrogant. Sorry about that. I lack social skills and I think thats naturally how I come off.

But I'm not making any demands. I like alot about dominions3, but these issues are driving me batty. They reduce the pleasure of playing for me alot. Yet they seem so simple in nature. So I list them and inquire about the possibility of their change/fixing. Any of them, not necessarily all. Seeing if they will be fixed or not and seeing how responsive developers are to issues and to the community(not much at all I gather) I'm also a sucker for a good debate and can easily get sucked into one, which is also a little of whats happening.

BTW, who ever mentioned the bug of the RMG where you run it twice in a row is right I think. The RMG has not given me a really twisted bad map since I now never run it if I've ran it before without closing down dom3 and reloading.

Also thanks PDF, that windowing trick helped alot. Now if I could only find out how to view those tips that flash by between turns. And why shift ? doesn't show me a list of hot keys (or do anything at all for that matter)

[Endoperez]

TruePurple said:
If the game kept track of the random number and gave you a average of that number.. Like lets say first turn the game says there are 20 troops. Next turn it gives and average of 70 troops. But because of the 20 troop figure the turn before it gives you an average guess of 35. Next turn it randomizes 50 troops figure. But because of the 20 & 70 numbers of the turns before it gives you a number thats an average of all 3 numbers.(additionally under the random number or in replace of it)

Such assumes the scout has an IQ number high enough to rub together and start a fire (2 )that he could work out averages. But makes sense in alot of ways both for game play and game reasoning (the longer you observe troops, the better you know their numbers) Yes players can keep track of and average these numbers but who wants to bother with that kind of work when playing?

This only works if the defenders don't change. Because the same algorithms are used for both independent provinces and enemy nations' provinces, approximation would mean that a province that had been empty for 4 turns and then had 100 troops passing by would show up as having 20 units. Furthermore, even independent provinces can have a varying amount of defenders in them. Events can add knights, vampires, trolls and various other things to independent provinces. These can double or triple the number of original defenders, and I'd rather be notified instantly. There is also at least one creature that moves from independent province to independent province without being part of any nation (Eater of the Dead once it becomes unfettered). It would be easy to mod it to be some kind of inquisitorial general and then add it to a map and give it an army, and in theory (I'm not sure if this would work) it would then move around the map with its army, going through independent provinces without harming them and rather randomly attacking human or AI players.

[TruePurple]

Yes I know the numbers can change, thats why I suggested a separate number for the average (current random, average #for the last 4 turns) If the current random is much different from the average you know somethings moved in/out.

But more simple approach could be, the average number resets every time the actual troop amount changes. (observer on the hill top: Damn, I think some troops left/arrived.. now I got to start over)

[Sandman]

Some players also like the excessive mortality of ... mortals, and your incapacity to make choices about how they developp their skills (chosing heroic ability or stats improved with xp), as it gives you more the impression of being a god far from these considerations. Personnally I would have nothing against easier healing, true resurrection spells, more hp for heroes, etc... and would like a lot the ability to make choices for heroes progression, like in all but this one fantasy games. But it seems a large part of the public find perma death, uncurable illnesses and a very poor xp system thematic, so this game will never have the classical RPG charm of MoM/AoW. Just adapt of find another game.

I agree. The harshness of the Dominions universe is a good thing, setting it apart in a genre where healing potions and resurrection are as common as bread.

[TruePurple]

What your replying to has the wrong end of the stick as a response to what I've been saying.

Like I've not made any comments at all for or against not being able to choose heroic ability etc (though it is a bit frustrating when your mage gets attack heroic ability)

Nor did I say anything about true resurrection or more HP for heroes (why would they need that?)

And I said nothing against the XP system. Its fine.

Why put words in my mouth?

But "thematically" disease being permanent is wrong. People often recover from disease. Or they die in short order. Long term ailments that just stick with you and cause trouble is only a common issue with modern medicine keeping you from death despite disease. So often disease should clear up (often leaving behind nasties) or kill the unit within a few months. Perhaps a one use herbal remady can be crafted with nature gems in an attempt to cure disease early.

Also there should be more ways to deal with ailments in general in a world full of magic.. thematically speaking. And practically speaking for a more enjoyable game IMO.

And old age should work better.. not be.. your fine till some magic number then magically get a ton of battle wounds and die within a few years.

Plus imagine.. having a super hard high level spell or other method that could actually manage to try to dispel a curse with cost. BTW, does luck attribute help protect you from curse effect? Does being blessed reduce your chances of being cursed?