Incentives to patch the game?

[Endoperez]

Jourdeloune, why would you like Dominions 4 to have spesifically great 3d graphics instead of great graphics, leaving the choice of 2d/3d to the developers? The latest Shrapnel Games' FRAG! newsletter (not available online, but I can provide the particular article if you're interested) discussed the necessity of 3d.

In short, there's no reason to use 3d for graphics, as far as the GRAPHICS go. It can be used to allow various gameplay elements in FPS or RTS games, and provides some problems with camera control, but 3d doesn't necessarily look better than 2d. Good 2d graphics look better than bad 3d, and while it's hard to make good-looking humans that are just 32 pixels high, it would be even harder to make good-looking humans when you have just few polygons to work with - not to mention complex forms with small animated parts such as hydra's heads, or a scorpion king (8 legs, 2 hands, a prehensile tail... it adds up). Furthermore, Dominions combat system can't use most of the 3d changes, because the lay of the land doesn't affect battles; only the dominion and scales, and sometimes the terrain of the province, have an effect in the battlefield. With no elevation bonuses and no line of sight, what could 3d be used for?

[Jourdelune]

Endoperez said:
Jourdeloune, why would you like Dominions 4 to have spesifically great 3d graphics instead of great graphics, leaving the choice of 2d/3d to the developers? The latest Shrapnel Games' FRAG! newsletter (not available online, but I can provide the particular article if you're interested) discussed the necessity of 3d.

In Fantasy General, in battle, you could "possess" unit to do battle!

I know the PBEM status, but the option to have active battle on/off switch is not a problem. ( look at Age of Wonders implementations )

Giving the possibility to take control of a UNIT to do any thing you like in the combat... 3D help terribly. With 3D you got first person / isometric view / top down view without redrawing every sprites you got.

The script then play it, should give new breath to the genre. In that regard, script it and play it give some RTS combat a new feel to the game. A lot of people have bought Total War for the RTS feel of battle and TBS feel of strategic development.

The combat engine could permit it, without redesigning it a lot. (simply adding the "possess" command on a unit choices (commander only or every unit possible).

Now, you can do something new... and less boring! Give unit moves or combo, or a lot of abilities that require skills and timing to be more efficient. (developing a new game in the old one -> Edi )

3D help to for the zoom in and zoom out model. While zooming in, you can see pretty cities and fort and so on, while zooming out we can have our old school strategic map has well.

Dominions got a nice engine (i don't know the code behind it, if it is OO (oriented object) with design pattern, it is simply easy to bring new features) you can add something new for the infinity.

I had played 2 years of Birthright : Gorgon Alliance. It was a blast. A kind of RTS tactical... (yeah it could be possible) with a nice 3D (false 3d, doom like) that give the possibilities to your heroes to do quest and dungeon crawling to get unique artifact.

That was really fun to change of pace of the game... TBS can be boring if they are always the same, night over nights... So, a 2 hours dungeon crawling for the sake of your Kingdom is even better...

And 3D... guess what... unfortunately, the gaming world sell on good looking game.

[Endoperez]

All ideas don't work. I could go into more detail about most of yours, but that doesn't benefit anyone.

1) Player-controlled battles would make multiplayer, except perhaps 1vs1, impossible. If it was a game option, we'd have two entirely different games that couldn't both be balanced. As an example, anything with good range and good precision could be used to kill 2-3 enemy commanders, and BAM you win. White Centaur with its bow and incredible speed, any S3 mage with Mind Burn, commander with flying and 5 flying bodyguards...

2) The graphical detail is in the map image. It doesn't change with seasons, between games, etc. For there to be anything to zoom at, the game would have to use maps that incorporate magic sites, forts, army sizes, events, pillaging, seasons and all that into the map itself. That would be nice, but would mean that maps would need predefined sprites/models, and as such would need a spesific editor, which would make mapmaking harder. (Yes, it would. Illwinter editors are hard to use, and map editors of other games can be used to make Dominions maps. Just add white dots!)

It would be nice to have Dominions with unique, movie-quality 3d models and maps, down to the little C'tissian running lizards moving the tax carts and the immigrants between the massive pine forests of the Jotunlands slowly being turned into mangrove swamps by the Miasma dominion. The battles would look awesome. I doubt Dominions will ever be there, though, and I know it'd make modding almost impossible. How could you add a Vaetti Archer if you'd have to create, texture and rig a 3d model? At the moment, anyone can change the 4-pixel spear into a 4-pixel bow. It won't look good, but it will work.

[Wikd Thots]

3D would put a real kink in the ability to mod. I have games where the next version added 3D and the good of it was way low compared to the modding that it killed.

[CUnknown]

I agree with Endoperez, I remember when I first starting playing Dom2, I was very disappointed about the lack of strategic control over the battles. I was used to Age of Wonders and games like that. But now, I don't miss it at all anymore, and in fact, I think lack of strategic control makes Dominions much better! If there was control over battles, the game would just take forever and balancing the units would be very difficult.

[PashaDawg]

Getting back to the original post... and, perhaps, this is now irrelevant because Jourdelune has perhaps already patched:

I can understand that buying a USB key is a costly solution to allow patching without internet at home. But, I suspect that you (Jourdelune) probably have a friend who already owns a USB key that you could borrow. After all, you only need it for a day. I'd be happy to lend you mine, but you're probably too far away.

[Edi]

Jourdelune said:
I don't know the difference between meant and mean... :S I should look into it.

Oh, sorry. English is not your first language. I tend to forget that with people, probably because it's my second language as well, but I'm as fluent in it as my native language. More so where vocabulary is concerned.

I'll explain:

• The word 'mean' as a verb is the same as 'intend' in some respects, to give meaning in others. E.g. "I mean that you should do <x>" or similar. The word 'meant' is the past tense, i.e. things that have already happened.
• As an adjective, 'mean' is the same as nasty, unpleasant, malicious. E.g. "Cheating on her was a mean thing to do" or similar.

That's actually why I asked about it, because depending on which usage of the word you read into those sentences of yours, the outcome is very, very different. Either "Meant to deter piracy" or "being mean to pirates", and the latter interpretation (which, looking at it now, would obviously be incorrect) would make your words come across as sympathetic toward pirates. This is about as good an example of the pitfalls possible with language barriers.

[lch]

Jourdelune said:
In Fantasy General, in battle, you could "possess" unit to do battle!

That post made me chuckle. Your main interest is probably to give some feedback to improve the game, but you have no idea how much work there is involved to get something like that. Remember that this is, programming-wise, a one man show. Most of the current users would probably not like something like that (which is kinda pointless in a turn-based game, anyway, it's just some gimmick) or even it won't work on their low-end systems, and people that are not users yet still wouldn't care at all. To me, a feature like that has never been real successful, or let's say: useful, in a game. First that comes to mind is Dungeon Keeper. I have recently seen some game where this seems moderately useful, a game which started as some FPS TeamArena clone and then had a RTS game added on top of it ("Commander Mode"). If you want a game like that, I suggest you should try playing it. But the FPS/RTS genre mix always seems lacking to me. Concentrate on your strength instead of producing an undefinable soup.