Scales bugs in Dom3.14

[Lingchih]

I haven't noticed it yet. But then, I always play with a high dominion.

[Sir_Dr_D]

I haven't tested it enough to be sure, but it seems when when I start a new game without closing down dominions first the scale bug occurs. But if I close down the program,reopen it, and then start the game things seem to be fine.

[Endoperez]

That was one of the symptoms of the old bug AFAIK. I think I'll have to test it. Blah.

[Endoperez]

First, The Scale Bug (TSB) also appears after restarting Dominions and creating a new game. It isn't restricted to only appearing after creating/playing multiple games in one sitting. TSB brings your scales down, and they usually stay down until the bug disappears.

Second, TSB disappears after all neighbouring provinces are under your dominion. After that point, your scales will increase the normal way, which can be slow. However, scales can go down if you ended the turn without your dominion in all neighbouring provinces. If you open your turn, see that scales went down, and have dominion in all neighbours, it's probably due to dominion spreading to the last province that turn.

Temperature varies with seasons. A province can go from neutral to Heat 3 in one turn (but that only happened once in my tests), so even your capital's temperature may vary. I don't if friendly dominion weakens the effect of seasons, but my tests were often made with rather low dominion in the capital. If Cold scale disappears in early game, it may be due to random chance. If Heat scale disappears, it's probably due to TSB.

TSB can affect Growth and Luck. I think the scale drain happens in order, so first you lose your Order, Then Production, etc etc. When I had just Growth, Luck and Magic, I first lost some Growth, then all; then some Luck.

I think dominion can increase the scales even when the capital is still affected by TSB. However, the chance of increase isn't that good, so it might take several (4-5 wasn't rare) turns after TSB is negated before you're back to full scales.

[Sir_Dr_D]

If thats the way that it works Endoperez then it sounds like a deliberate feature. Whether or not it is a feature that imbalances things, I don't know.
- It might now balance dominion with the other pretender points, or it may be unfairly forcing everyone to take high dominion.
- Water nations on maps like Cradle will be hit hit the hardets, but hopefully land nations will now respect a water nations right to have the land provinces surrounding their capital.
- This will now make stealthy priests more valuable, as they can now lower the enemies dominion in a province beside the enemies captial, and ruin the enemies scales. (But id this is a bug and not a "feature", this should be considered an exploit )
- This will prevent order rushes at the beginning of the game, where with a high income, production, and by buying mercenaries you can quickly expand. This may encourage people to take awake pretenders, with blesses, but bad scales even more.

Mostly I just want to khow how the bug behaves, so i can learn how to control it, and adjust my strategies.

[vfb]

Sir_Dr_D said:
If thats the way that it works Endoperez then it sounds like a deliberate feature. Whether or not it is a feature that imbalances things, I don't know.
- It might now balance dominion with the other pretender points, or it may be unfairly forcing everyone to take high dominion.
- Water nations on maps like Cradle will be hit hit the hardets, but hopefully land nations will now respect a water nations right to have the land provinces surrounding their capital.
...

You don't need to own the province neighbors. You need your dominion in the province neighbors.

Also, if this is by design, then I think all capitols should start with neutral scales in turn 1.

[thejeff]

Also if it's by design it really should, thematically speaking , affect all scales, good and bad, equally.

Especially when not all the bad scales are bad for all nations. Temperature scales are the obvious ones, but if Pans can start spawning Maeneads in high Turmoil at once and their enemy can't afford troops since he lost his Order, for example.

And why not Luck and Magic? Sounds like somethings being checked from the top of the list. Order is most likely to be affected and Magic the least?

[Nikolai]

I know I am never playing with Dominion under nine anymore. I hate new 'feature'. It removes many builds, it hurts low/high temperature nations...

Dominion already propagated. Neighbor province dominion already affected _dominion_ in capital. Why should scales be affected too?

I can see for temperature, but if my people in border province strongly believe in my Pretender's ideals, like discipline and hard work, why should they care that Pangaeans across border spend their time partying? It's one thing being penalized for losing dominion battle in your own lands. It's another for scales to spread across borders no matter what.